An interesting way to look back at history is to play the "What If?" game. As the name states, you take an event you are studying, look at a decision someone made, and ask yourself "What if they had done something different?" This type of game usually lends itself to great discussion and debate.
So I'm going to set up a "What If?" and in the comments section you are going to answer. Feel free to reference other's comments and respectfully disagree if you do not see eye-to-eye.
Jackson Era "What If?" Scenario
Jackson's first major act as president, as you know, was to push the Indian Removal Act through Congress. When challenged in the courts by Samuel Worcester, Chief Justice John Marshall sided with the natives. Jackson, upon hearing the verdict, basically refused to follow it. What if Jackson had submitted to Marshall's authority? What if Jackson pulled back the reins on removal at that point? Would anything really have changed?
If Jackson did submit to Marshall's authority I think things would be much different. The Trail of Tears might not have ever happened and maybe Native Americans would have a large population and not be on reservations, and actually had their own land. If Jackson stopped trying to push the act through Congress, maybe another President would have finished the job for him. Things probably could have changed. If the Removal Act was tossed out, then many Native Americans would have been alive. But, maybe it wouldn't have changed a lot. Martin Van Buren actually enforced the Removal Act, so probably he would have taken the Removal Act and used it.(113)
ReplyDeleteBasically you are asking what if Jackson wasn’t an idiot. Well, I don’t think many things would be different. I think that if Jackson hadn’t forced the Natives out of the East, it would have eventually happened later. There were many people that didn’t like them. It was certainly not just Andrew. I think somewhere down the line, someone would have done it. Martin Van Buren? He was one of the men who shared many of the same beliefs. I mean he is the one who actually was president during the Trail of Tears. He obviously didn’t like them either or else he would’ve stopped the whole thing! and I’m sure he could’ve. The supreme court would have been on his side. My point is, this was not Jacksons fault. He grew up in a society that didn’t like the different people. Even if he hadn’t. If he had a love for them, someone would be in the way. Someone would do exactly what he did. It’s a really sad thing to say but I honestly think that it is true.
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What if Jackson didn't go through with the IRA? I believe someone somewhere would have eventually done it. I agree with Jared- he said it was certainly not just Andrew who didn't like the Native Americans. Many people didn't. But if Jackson hadn't done it, it might have been a while until someone actually did. But I don't think it was possible to avoid. Some people can't accept the fact that we are made different. Martin Van Buren was the one who actually went through with it. Maybe he wouldn't have if Jackson hadn't started it, but who knows! But at a different point of view the Natives had several chances to assimilate (to fit in and live in society). My mom read a journal that my ancestor, who was friends with Jackson, wrote. He wrote about how Jackson gave the natives tons of chances to fit in. It was kinda like the inaugural speeches that Jackson spoke. He started out being kind and friendly. I think he really tried to let them fit in. When they didn't he had to make them move. They didn't really know what to do with them after they refused to try to fit in. So it can be looked at two different ways. (210)
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ReplyDeleteI agree with Alaina and Jared. I think if Andrew Jackson had actually done what he was supposed to do and not what he wanted to do, things would probably be the same. I mean there were very few people who liked the natives. Somewhere down the road it would have happened. I don’t think there was anyway to avoid the Indian Removal Act. Andrew Jackson did come up with the idea and he may have started it, but Martin Van Buren was President during the Trail of Tears. He could have stopped it but he didn’t. He obviously didn’t like the natives enough to stop 4,000 Cherokee from dying on the way to Oregon. Like Alaina said “some people can’t accept that we are made differently.” I think it is crazy how people can’t live with people who are different from them. (143)
ReplyDeleteI’m personally not a big fan of the what if game, because I start to drive my self crazy with it. Ex. What if 911 never happened or what if Adam and Eve never committed the 1st sin in the garden? I do not like to play this game because the point is “this” is what happened and “that” never did. But, in this case with Gen. Jackson I am not totally sure the results would have been any different at all. Because, like Jared said there were a ton of other people who did not like the Indians. At the time, the people probably really liked that Andrew Jackson and Martin Van Buren got the Indians out of “their” land. It is that entitlement mentallity. You feel like you are supposed to get/have certain things just because you are you. We have people like that today in our society. They think that they should not have to work and that the government should just give them everything. Now don’t get me wrong this is not everyone in these situstions. The bottom line is that Jackson is not the only one to blame for this event in history. Although, he was a major part in it their were others who could have probably stopped it but didn’t. (217)
ReplyDeleteI agree with Jared, Alaina and Tori, that someone at some point would have pushed the Native Americans out and taken the land they lived on. Andrew Jackson may have given the Native Americans an opportunity to leave peacefully. However, what a thing to ask someone to leave the place that they called home. If someone came in and asked me to leave my home, I would not go peacefully either! If Jackson had submitted to Marshall's authority, many Native Americans may have survived, at least for a while. If Jackson had backed off, maybe the Native Americans would have left eventually on their own. Unfortunately, I do not think things would have really been very different. For some reason, the people who hold offices or have any "power" in our country tend to focus on their wants. As Erin said, we feel entitled to whatever we want. (148)
ReplyDeleteI agree with Jared. If he actually submitted to Marshall the whole country would have changed. That is because there would be different kind of people and a whole lot of them in the South Eastern region of the United States. He was an idiot for not listening to Marshall. He should have listened because then he would have saved a ton of people. John Marshall was the right one and Andrew Jackson was the wrong one. I think he should have just waited for the Native Americans to move because of all the Americans moving into their land it would get to crowded and then they will have to move. That would have been the right choice for the Indian Removal Act. This whole country would have changed because there would have been a lot of Native Americans in this country. Then I think if there were more people in the country then the government would be getting more money for taxes. That is what i think Andrew Jackson should have done. (173)
ReplyDeleteFirst off, I definitely agree with Erin. I also drive myself crazy with the “what if” game. Jackson submitting to someone else’s authority would be so unlike him. Jackson was a stubborn man, and being the donkey he was, he didn’t care what others thought, he just HAD to get his way. But, if he did stop the IRA from happening, then the Native Americans could have their own little country inside of America. Or, they could’ve still been kicked off their land by MVB or some other president that was somewhat like Jackson. Even if he did stop the IRA, he didn’t have any control on future presidents so it would probably happen anyway. The Trail of Tears was basically inevitable. Because every president’s views are different, it’s impossible to say what would happened if Jackson ‘pulled back the reins’ on the IRA. I think Jackson went on with the IRA just to kind of rub in John Marshall’s face and say, “haha you have no control of me! I do what I want to do!” There are many different “what if” scenarios you could follow in this particular issue.
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I think that if Andrew Jackson hadn’t removed the Native Americans off their own land, then eventually someone else would have. The hatred towards the natives just continued to grow so I bet if Jackson hadn’t removed them than the next candidate to do so would be Martin Van Buren. Now this is the “what if” game so I can do anything, right? So what if no president had made the Natives move to the West. We might have another country in the middle of the United States called something like “The Indian Republic” or something else. There would definitely be more Native American descendants walking around in your neighbor hood. All of the Pro sports team like the NBA, MLB, NHL, and the NSL would probably have more Natives playing in them. But that’s just “what if.” So I’m going to have to agree with Jared :) and all of his other followers that agree with him too. (159)
ReplyDeleteI would like to assume that if Jackson had just forgotten the Indian Removal Act like the Supreme Court wanted him to, people would start to live with and get along with the Natives. That the Trail of Tears would have never happened and those 4,000 Cherokee wouldn't have died before and during it. But unfortunately, like Jared and Alaina said, somebody else later on probably would have passed the Indian Removal Act if Andrew Jackson didn't. I don't know why so many people were opposed to the Natives just because their skin color and culture were different. They probably thought we were weird, too. It's sad how cruel and thoughtless people in this world can be sometimes.(118)
ReplyDeleteIf Jackson did not overrule Marshall’s ruling, it would have only delayed the inevitable. Eventually tensions would rise to a boiling point and by one way or another; the Cherokee’s land would be taken. It would probably go down like this: someone or some group, fuelled by greed, would stir up everyone else against the Cherokee. Then they would forcibly take their lands and there would be more deaths than in the trail of tears. So in the long term Jackson kicking out the Cherokee may have been a lesser evil in the long run, but really who can tell what would have happened.
ReplyDeleteI think that if Andrew Jackson had listened to John Marshall things would be different for a while, but then they would just have the same outcome as it did. I think that enough people didn't like the natives that eventually someone would think of the same thing Jackson did and force them out of their home land. If Andrew Jackson did listen to the Chief Justice and nothing changed then, when Martin Van Buren became President he would not listen to him and go ahead with the Indian Removal Act. Maybe if they took a different approach on telling the Natives to leave, so many of them wouldn't have died. If they asked more peacefully they might have had a better chance of them leaving, but then again who wants to leave the place you grew up at just because some white man who says he has control over you tells you to go. Also what if enough people liked the Natives and tried to stop Jackson? I think that would have a totally different outcome but who knows. (180 words)
ReplyDeleteI agree with Tori and Alaina. If Andrew Jackson had not gone through with the Indian Removal I am sure someone would have down the line. Pretty much ever one thought low of the natives and would have sure forced them out eventually. What if Jackson was not like he was. forcing innocent people pretty much to their death. Someone would have eventually done it. It did not seem like Martin Van Buren did anything to help it, maybe it could have stopped it but what if? 87 what if the Indian Removal was never thought of and the natives were our neighbors. What if they had stayed? I think it would have been better because our world would be better in a way of not wasting everything like we do. Because the IR happened things did change. (136)
ReplyDeleteI think that even if Jackson had submitted to Marshall, the outcome would have been only temporarily different. There were so many people that supported Jackson and the Indian (Native American) removal act, that it would have been done anyways, plus with the people crazed for gold, they would have been moved in the search. But you never know, the people that supported Jackson could have changed their views about the Natives, and they could have been just enough to keep the Natives from being moved, for Jacksons lifetime at least. Then again, we could have held off, and the Natives would get stronger, and forced us out of America and we could be typing this blog in Spanish... (219 words)
ReplyDeleteI think it was a very poor decision by Jackson to force the Cherokee off their land. We should have been able to abide with them peacefully, instead of following the example of the European despots or dictators.
ReplyDeleteIf Jackson had not directly overstepped the wishes of the Supreme Court I believe that things would have turned out differently for everyone. For a while everything would be dandy for a while, and then conflicts would erupt among the Cherokee and whites. Skirmishes would break out because of land disputes and things would just get worse and worse (especially because there was gold in the area the Cherokee were occupying). Eventually a war would break out, and more Cherokee would die than on the trail of tears, along with many Americans. It was a terrible thing, the Indian Removal Act, but I think it had a reason for its place in history; however abhorrent it may be.
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Hey Mr. Haston, notice how I'm the only one who indented!
What if Jackson had done what Marshall said to do. If he didn't someone probably would. The disagreement was so strong that I don't think it could have been avoided. America was supposed to be a place for everyone but Americans walk didn't really match their talk. They talked about all this freedom yet wouldn't let the natives stay. They had been here first and had the right but because we were so selfish they got kicked out. This is the what if game..... so what if the government hadn't kicked them out. An individual group of Americans would have probably done it themselves. Just look at what small groups of people have done in the past to change America. When they had their mind set on something they are going to seek out their plan with or without they governments help. In their minds there way only one way for things to be. They wouldn't have it any other way. They wouldn't play the what if game. It was their way only and their weren't going to be any if, ands or buts about it. (187 words)
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